New York based and long time running Underground label, Paragon Records started in 2000 (?) and made it as far as 2009. Nine years doing an independent Underground Label is something not so common these days. Specially just these previous years where internet starts taking over. Not to mention a few new labels that is eclipsing everybody by spending time cashing in with known releases than presenting us a new band to discover. This interview focuses only to Paragon Records, since no one even tries to interview a label these days it seems! I got this very informative interview with one of the label’s founder, Mike. I forgot to ask a few more important questions but that’s alright…
Paragon Records has been here for a long while now, how do you keep the label going strong until these present days? Can you recall and tell us its humble beginnings?
Hail brother. We keep the label strong basically because we work really hard it. You have to if your going to keep it going. Yes I can re-call our humble beginnings with hardly any stock and only a release or 2 under our belts. But our goals with this label are still far from being reached.
I see you got thousands of items in stock, how do you acquire them? What method do you prefer to work the most: wholesales or trades? What gives the most benefit? How do you approach these labels to work with you? Specially those labels that you might be making contact for the first time? What are your trade policies?
By trading mostly. It is the way of the underground and something I personally really respect. Wholesale and trading are both good but I personally prefer trading. They both give the same benefit as long as what you are getting sells. I simply just contact a label to work something out or they contact me first. It is very simple. I send a short to the point email or a snail mail letter. Whether it‘s a first time contact or someone I trade with often does not really change the way I email them, for the most part anyway. The trade policies are simple as well…, for example 1 cd for 1 cd , 1 lp for 1 lp, we both send our trade at the same time, or if they have contacted me first and I have never heard of them I ask them to send there trade first and I will send mine when I have received there trade etc… .
What does it take for a band to be signed by Paragon Records? What genre you prefer a band should be? What are the factors to consider when working with a band? Attitude? Skills? How about licensed releases? I think you also have those…
We have to like the band. No specific genre really…, though I guess we really like the black metal, death metal genres here at paragon. The band has to have a good attitude and of course play there instruments well. And just work hard on there end to make our partnership work the best. We have licensed releases or co-op deals. But this is something we will probably not look to take part in to much in the future. As this is something where the results have not been that great for us.
How are you able to spread the name of your bands? Do you spend money advertising in magazines, banner ads in the internet, etc? Or co-op advertising maybe? Are you making contact with any Metal Magazine writer to get your bands appearing in there? What method do you think gives the best recognition for your bands?
We spread the name of our bands by ads in metal mags and underground zines, sometimes flyers, promoting them online, and of our course the trading and wholesaling we do with other labels , distros etc… . I believe my partner jim has done some co-op advertising in the past [though I am not certain] which has been ok. We have a promoter who gets in touch with the magazines we said promo copies to who tries to make sure they review our releases. I think at this point advertising through the internet seems to get the best results for your bands as just about everybody who is in the underground is online these days. I know some diehards will hate to read that but that is the truth. But it’s really not a bad thing.
These days competition was very stiff. How do you manage to compete with nowadays hundreds of labels and distros? Do you take booths on gigs and sell merchandise in there? Does that really help or what?
It’s not easy and I hate to look at it that way. As the underground is brotherhood to me but the fact of the matter is whether you like it or not it is a competition to be successful. Yes we do booths at gigs and yes it does really help to move your stock, bring some money in, and also get your name out there more.
Can you tell us what it takes in creating a label like Paragon Records? If someone wants to build his own label (a real label, not cdr label), what kind of stuff will you tell them to consider first before implementing their plans?
You have to have a vision for what you want. Start slow though. Don’t rush into signing as many bands as possible. This is a mistake. Really you should also have a strong financial situation. This is not something we did at the beginning and I think it hurt us personally. Get in touch with as many people as possible. And always handle yourself in a respectful and professional manner to your fellow brothers and sisters in the underground. It’s a small community when you really look at the underground. You either get it or you don’t. There is a certain way things run here. And respect is a big thing here. So you better show it or go somewhere else.
Business wise… What are the factors to consider maintaining a steady cash flow? It takes money to make money, so, do you look forward in these so-called ROI? Apart from spreading the name of your bands, how do you exactly spread the name of the label? What about this “street team”? Do you use them?
This is very hard especially in these hard economic times and all the illegal downloading. You have to do just about whatever you can to bring money in. If that means you having to go to the customers or the stores yourself to sell your product then you do it. Sorry but what does ROI stand for?? Spreading the name of the label is done in the same manner of spreading the band name such as promoting on-line, magazine ads etc… . We have thought of a street team and this is not a bad idea. But to be honest there is no money to pay for this not to mention you really need a scene in your area with lots of shows to really make this work for you and we just don’t have that around here.
How are you able to work with retail shops / online shops? Do you work with consignment? Do you think this method helps? Specially these days were rip offs breed themselves everywhere…
Retail shops we usually sell to wholesale and we can do this with some on-line shops as well. We do work with consignment and this works well for us as well. Rip offs are always going to be there. You just need to know the signs and you will learn to avoid them most of the time. And this of course comes with experience.
What do you prefer releasing: a re-release of an out-of-print album from a well-known band or a new album from an unknown band? I see some labels MOSTLY do the ‘out-of-print’ in multi-colored vinyls and rarely got their own releases, what exactly the reason for this? To save the lost cash spent in the unknown band?
I prefer to release a new album from an unknown band or a re-release and album from a not so well known band as we did with Frost from Hungary and a few other bands. But a re-release from a more known band is ok like we did with black crucifixion “promethean gift” cd. But it had a really nice layout and four bonus tracks making it a cd and not a mcd like the original release was. so it was a special release. Not to mention the original release of the mcd is impossible to find. As far as all these out of print multi-colored vinyls etc… I know what you mean. Everybody’s interests are different in the underground so to each there own. But I do personally feel it’s a little excessive with all these re-releases in general and the focus should be more on new releases or releases that were very hard to find originally. It could be used to save on bands that have lost money but you never really know unless you are involved with the label personally.
In relation to the previous question… if the label is losing money for that unknown band, is it maybe because they didn’t spend so much in promoting/spreading the name of it and focus more in packing orders of the long lost out of print band. Back then, this ‘out of print’ band is also one of those unknown bands too. It’s just they simply get known because of tremendous label work. Thoughts?
It could be the reason. But in all truth it could be just because there is not a lot of interest in that band. The underground world can be very picky and if a band is not welcomed or there is not much interest or buzz there then your release could really do poorly. But if a band does have more sales potential then another band it is true that the one band will be more of a priority then the other. Which is not really fair at all. This is something I can honestly say at Paragon Records we don’t do. We have always tried to treat our bands fairly and do the most for each and every one of them. And sometimes you have to remember some bands ask you to promote them in a certain way or don’t want any promotion at all especially if there release is very limited or something. And you have to follow these guidelines.
What about the bloggers/mp3 sharing of an entire album. Does that affect the sales? Is it bringing you any benefits? That is either in a good or a bad way…
Yes it does. It has hurt sales from the underground to the pop industry. I think it can bring you benefits but you have to utilize the internet to work for you and this is something that will be changing with paragon records in the near future. On a personal note the fact of people wanting there quick fix on music and even if they like what they hear, not wanting to hold the actual product in their hands I think is pretty sad and does not interest me at all. I was born a collector and I will proudly die as one as well.
How do you manage your time? How many ‘crew’ does Paragon Records have? How is the usual day you guys have for the label? How many orders everyday? What is the frequency of email reply to customers? What are the future plans? Did you ever have any visions that Paragon might be something like Relapse someday?
It can be pretty rough at times. As we are losing one person soon and will be down to just 3 here at Paragon. We all have regular jobs. My job is personally easy and does not really get in the way with what I do with Paragon Records. I wish I could say the same for the other 2 but their jobs suck and they know it. But our jobs pay the bills. Paragon does not pay anything. A usual day can vary on how much time you spend on the label depending on how many emails you have to answer, orders you get, trades to be packed, trips to the post office etc… As far as orders from customers things have been so slow. The worst they have ever been actually. If a customer emails a question or places an order it is usually taken care of immediately or as soon as we are on-line of course. We have some big plans this year and going into 2010 for Paragon that I cannot reveal at this time as things are still in the works. To be more known as a Relapse records and have there success would be great. But the goal of giving us all steady pay checks and really being able to just make this our full time job would be good enough for us.
I don’t know if this is correct, but are you willing to tell us your resources? Like where do you get your CDs printed, vinyls, and shirts done etc. Something like to help any guys to start their own label maybe…
These are some of the places we use below.
Cd pressing plant - http://www.builtbyicon.com/
Shirts - marty/bindrune korgull@chartermi.net
Vinyl [12 inches] http://brooklynphono.com/
Vinyl 12 inch jackets, inlays, stickers, posters etc… http://www.iloveimprint.com
Vinyl [7”] http://www.piratespress.com/home/
Vinyl mastering http://www.aardvarkmastering.com/
Patches http://www.moritzembroidery.com/cms/templates/motemp.aspx?articleid=31&zonei d=8
Ok Mike, take the last space on your own and thanks for the time spent…
Thanx for this interview and the support towards Paragon Records we really appreciate it. Anyone looking to get in touch our contact info is below. Best of luck to you brother. M
PARAGON RECORDS
31 CEDAR RIDGE DRIVE
RIDGE NY 11961
USA
WEB SITE - www.paragonrecords.org
EMAIL - cultm@msn.com
MY SPACE - http://www.myspace.com/paragon_records
EMAIL - cultm@msn.com
DISCOGRAPHY (Label Releases)
DIAMATREGON - Crossroad LP
[prg 17036]
CASTEVET - Stones/Salts 7″ EP
[prg 40038]
DARK CELEBRATION - Phlegeton: The Transcendence of Demon Lords CD
[prg 38035]
KHORS - Mysticism CD
[prg 39036]
CRUCIFIER - Trampled Under Cloven Hooves 10″ MLP
[prg 37034]
ANAEL - From Arcane Fires CD
[prg 36033]
VORKUTA/KRATORNAS - Monoliths of Annihilation split 7″
[prg 32027]
DARKESTRAH - The Great Silk Road Digi-CD
[prg 35032]
UNDIMENSIONAL - s/t Cassette
[prg 34031]
COPREMESIS - Muay Thai Ladyboys CD
[prg 34031]
CELESTIA - Frigidiis ApotheosiA : AbstinenciA GenesiiS CD
[prg 30030
RIGOR SARDONICOUS - Valles Ex Umbra De Mortuus CD/LP/Cass
[prg 23028]
BLACK CRUCIFIXION - Promethean Gift CD
[prg 26029]
AETHERIUS OBSCURITAS - Viziok CD
[prg 33027]
ASH POOL - World Turns on its Hinge LP
[prg 32026]
CHARNEL VALLEY - The Igneous Race CD/MC
[prg 27025]
ASH POOL - Black Bondage in the North 7″ EP
[prg 32024]
VORKUTA - Into The Chasms of Lunacy CD
[prg 31023]
CELESTIA - Apparitia-Sumptuous Spectre CD
[prg 30022]
EYES OF LIGEIA - A Fever Which Would Cling to Thee CDe Forever CD
[prg-30022]
BLACK CRUCIFIXION - Faustian Dream CD
[prg-26021]
SKYFORGER - Kauja Pie Saules CD
[prg -29020]
BIOLICH - The Space Between Home and Today MCD
[prg-28019]
CHARNEL VALLEY - The Dark Archives CD
[prg27018]
RIGOR SARDONICOUS - Apocalypsis Damnare CD
[prg23015]
BLACK CRUCIFIXION - Fallen One of Flames MCD/T-shirt/Long Sleeve
[prg26017]
FROST - Extreme Loneliness Fragments CD
[prg25016]
IMPIETY - Paramount Evil CD
[prg24015]
RIGOR SARDONICOUS - Principia Sardonica CD
[prg23014]
DECIEVERION - Despodent 7″
[prg 21012]
ALGOL/SHROUD OF DESPONDENCY - Whispers from an Empty Room CD
[prg 20011]
ELITE - Kampen CD
[prg 19010]
DIMENTIANON - Seven Suicides CD
[prg 18009]
DIAMATREGON - Charognard 7″
[prg17008]
VEDIOG SVAOR - In The Distance CD
[prg16007]
PROPHELATION - Paving the Road To Oblivion pro-CD-R
[prg 15005]
THE FORGOTTEN/RIGOR SARDONICOUS - split 7″
[prg 14005]
THE FORGOTTEN - L’aldila CD
[prg 14004]